Are there any videos of downed aircraft? I haven't seen any. Beware of fake news and repurposed videos and photos in rapidly changing situations such as this.
There are pics of a cargo plane on fire (in the sky) but no proof of it being what is purported. Also video of a copter shooting at vehicles on a road, and video of a missile shooting at a helicopter that missed and subsequently hit the fuel depot.
Ritter's framing of recent events looks like the most complete, convincing and eloquent of them all so far. I'm just a bit stunned by Prigozhin's utter stupidity. Those Western, secret service whisperers must be unbelievably seductive and manipulative to induce such blinkered foolishness.
'Turn around,
Go back down,
Back the way you came,
Can't you see that flash of fire ten times brighter than the day?'
I worked with a Jew decades ago who had been on a kibbutz in israhell for awhile. I asked him about the bacon/pork thing and he told me they raise pigs on concrete platforms so that they aren't "raised on the land". If true just just more proof of their hypocrisy.
To troll the West. NATO's grand Operation Babarossa failed miserably and is just going to fizzle out. This may convince the West to throw more soldiers into the meat grinder.
Actually, in all of this, bearing in mind that, as the article points out Prigozhin does not attack Putin, I am in favour of the comment by Larry at sonar21: "However, Prigozhin’s crazed outburst could be an unprecedented Maskirovka move. If you have Russian troops moving in “response” to his call for a coup it could be a ploy to mask the concentration of Russian forces for an unexpected offensive."
Very delicate and complicated situation. I hope this is resolved because infighting like this can lead to serious stability consequences. This is exactly what NATO wants. Do they not see this? This can be resolved after the war.
I could imagine that this is a MOD psyop exactly to "give NATO what it wants", in order to lure them into continuing the conventional counter-offensive and into not carrying out other operations like false flags.
There will be no instability in reality - but the West now has had its wet dream confirmed in its own eyes.
Real damage has been done and Prigozhin will have Russian blood on his hands because of the above.
I see zero possibility of any form of popular or Russian military, Rosgardia, other PMC or any other form of Russian support for the chef. As Mercouris and Christoforou noted - this is an infant throwing a tantrum and breaking furniture.
I'm not inclined to think he's acting. I do agree with him, however, when he says that Russia is taking way too long to finish this off. The more time Russia takes, the more time it gives for Ukulele and NATO to pull shit, and the more unforced errors can occur.
I understand the viewpoint, yet for many reasons you do not easily give up such very high kill ratios, (all wars are logistic wars) and NATO is struggling to power any industry, let alone a real war effort, let alone to replace what is being lost now. And why now, when so much military sucess is being achieved. It is very odd. I go with crazy or a weird gambit, although I do not see how that would payoff.
Let me get this straight now... all the "hip-hip hurray Ukraine is winning" zipper heads are cheering this alleged (or actual coup) as a major victory for Ukraine... when it is actually a death sentence for Ukraine if this is true--as this head of Wagner is not against Putin and the military for waging war against Ukraine--the head of Wagner is against the Russian MOD generals for not going "full Ghengis Khan mode" against Ukraine and for not impaling all Uke prisoners like Vlad Tepish and for not employing tactical nuclear weapons against NATO? --am I right?
No its good for Russia and time is on Russian side.
If Russia goes to western Ukraine Russia will have to fight with polish army there. Be real man. War is not against ukies, war is NATO-Russia. proxy one. from very beginning.
War is againt US hegemony or US totalitarism over the planet. To be specific western transnational oligarchy vs national governments.
Ukies are just proxy army for NATO just like taliban mujahedeens back in days or Isis atm.
The nuclear power plant will be next. The Russians have allowed the Ukuleles to remain too physically close to it for too long. They should've pushed the Ukulele army further west, away from the plant, sooner
Time is not "on Russia's side" and Russia has wasted plenty of it.
Exactly.more time Russia wastes, more time parasite English have to plot so many scenarios they have already bombed gas pipe line, new bridge, another bridge connecting Ukraine to mainland etc
Russia is expert in turning almost won wars into quagmire and frozen conflict .look at syria.look at Donbass from 2015. Putin is not fit to be president sergie Ivanov or demetri rigozhin should have been President
I would like to think an option you missed, which is. This is all an act to get the ukies excited and rush in somewhere, probably bahkmut and get wiped out, as not too too much has been going on recently.
However, i think hes just broke his brain and needs locking in a nut house. I'd say war breaks some people, but hes just a pr guy that doesnt do any fighting so i doubt thats it.
Also, i thought letting wagner get this big was a bad idea 9 months ago.
The thing that kind of makes me think it is a psyops is that he wasn't dealt with expeditiously when he first started acting out. He was/is allowed to continue ranting and raving and now this alleged coup attempt --- just doesn't pass the sniff test...
In hindsight, in the Era of Global Internet Trolling, has POTUS Trump or Biden been the "most effective" communicator of American desires and intentions?
The Russian folk see Prig as a kind of Trump, I believe. They are not as easily lead as Western fools with Trump-Derangement-Syndrome.
As for benefits.... Prig is currently the No.1 shared topic among Ukie soldiers and pro-Ukie propaganda networks. He also happens to be the Russian commander who took Bakhmut.
The thing that makes me think it wasn’t a psyop is that the net effect of all this leads much of the emerging pro-Russia world to question the stability of Russia and whether it is prudent to continue along the course of western non-alignment. The Russian government has had substantial success in the diplomatic sphere and would not jeopardize this over some short-term goal of military reorganization through a psyop. Also, Putin doesn’t appear to play those games. His love for his country precludes such nonsense.
I don't think so - Putin should have this fiasco squashed (hopefully) within a week, hopefully by the end of the week-end. Then, shore up the troops, the Russian people and crush the Ukraine and any others that strike at the motherland.
I hope you are right. It is impossible to know if he has the support of the PMCs. Only time will tell. But there’s no other word for Prigozhin than TRAITOR.
There is a more sinister probability. That CIA/Ukraine intelligence services have literally fooled Prigozhin into believing that MOD is out to get him. This would require a very sophisticated network of handsomely-rewarded traitors feeding Prigozhin false narratives and sophisticated communications to appear legitimate when they're actually not. How many of Prigozhin's inner circle would betray him for payoff of $50 million each from CIA? Spending $200 MM to cause a major "internal" problem/distraction for MOD is a cheap bargain for NATO compared to the +$100 billion spent so far.
Prigozhin clearly lost his shit. Nobody needs to get to someone who has lost his shit.
Russia absorbing Wagner into the Russian military - because Russian law does not permit PMCs to fight in Russia - is perfectly legit but is clearly what tipped Prigozhin over the edge.
Are there any videos of downed aircraft? I haven't seen any. Beware of fake news and repurposed videos and photos in rapidly changing situations such as this.
There are pics of a cargo plane on fire (in the sky) but no proof of it being what is purported. Also video of a copter shooting at vehicles on a road, and video of a missile shooting at a helicopter that missed and subsequently hit the fuel depot.
There is. At least thirteen people were killed.
Nope, no pics.
I watched Scott, I can confidently say that it's real. This war gonna take totally different course after tonight.
Ritter's framing of recent events looks like the most complete, convincing and eloquent of them all so far. I'm just a bit stunned by Prigozhin's utter stupidity. Those Western, secret service whisperers must be unbelievably seductive and manipulative to induce such blinkered foolishness.
'Turn around,
Go back down,
Back the way you came,
Can't you see that flash of fire ten times brighter than the day?'
—Hamilton Camp
Substack knows that USD is becoming worthless then???
he and his men now just received extremely important objectives.
Yet if one is going to betray their postion, would not one do so before they complete their most importtant mission seviceing Russias needs?
Bwahahahahaha
Not very sensible a reply!
Never trust anyone who wont eat bacon.
I worked with a Jew decades ago who had been on a kibbutz in israhell for awhile. I asked him about the bacon/pork thing and he told me they raise pigs on concrete platforms so that they aren't "raised on the land". If true just just more proof of their hypocrisy.
You're yapping crap.
If it's crap it's his (the jew) crap .
No, sorry.
Not so easy to weasel out.
Take responsibility.
If you're just yapping hearsay crap without any direct evidence.
Then it's you yapping crap.
However much you want to blame someone else.
Get it?
Vegans? /s
ROFLMAO.....cracked me up man :D
Putin has Jewish blood too. And so did Hitler.
Moscow is very far from Rostov.
Do they mean to encircle Crimea?
Nothing is happening. Everyone who thinks its real revolt or sponsored by western globo is just meh...
pure HOLLYWOOD
give oscars to bold guy.
PS just saw how progozhin is talking with some russian generals.
guys it just lame acting for dumb ppl. literally ridiculous
BUT i have no idea why do we need such performances. and do we need at all?
big question.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUa9_QDQsMM
To troll the West. NATO's grand Operation Babarossa failed miserably and is just going to fizzle out. This may convince the West to throw more soldiers into the meat grinder.
Actually, in all of this, bearing in mind that, as the article points out Prigozhin does not attack Putin, I am in favour of the comment by Larry at sonar21: "However, Prigozhin’s crazed outburst could be an unprecedented Maskirovka move. If you have Russian troops moving in “response” to his call for a coup it could be a ploy to mask the concentration of Russian forces for an unexpected offensive."
Thank you for your timely reporting!
Aaaand it's done.
Very delicate and complicated situation. I hope this is resolved because infighting like this can lead to serious stability consequences. This is exactly what NATO wants. Do they not see this? This can be resolved after the war.
There won't be any instability, not for long, as there's Akhmat Regiment & Reserved Soldiers always ready to take over.
The Chechens got snubbed by MOD for tooting their successes too loudly.
They were told to stop recording, off from social media. Then wagner comes, now they were told the same thing.
I could imagine that this is a MOD psyop exactly to "give NATO what it wants", in order to lure them into continuing the conventional counter-offensive and into not carrying out other operations like false flags.
It would be the most idiotic psyop ever. This will get more Russians killed.
"This is exactly what NATO wants."
Or this is exactly what Russia wants NATO to think. IMO, Russia knows the real war has been between Russia and the United States all along.
There will be no instability in reality - but the West now has had its wet dream confirmed in its own eyes.
Real damage has been done and Prigozhin will have Russian blood on his hands because of the above.
I see zero possibility of any form of popular or Russian military, Rosgardia, other PMC or any other form of Russian support for the chef. As Mercouris and Christoforou noted - this is an infant throwing a tantrum and breaking furniture.
The west will false flag Moscow and blame it on Prigozhin.
Putin should've killed Prigozhin months ago, after his first little video.
Which is why I believe he's just acting.
I'm not inclined to think he's acting. I do agree with him, however, when he says that Russia is taking way too long to finish this off. The more time Russia takes, the more time it gives for Ukulele and NATO to pull shit, and the more unforced errors can occur.
I understand the viewpoint, yet for many reasons you do not easily give up such very high kill ratios, (all wars are logistic wars) and NATO is struggling to power any industry, let alone a real war effort, let alone to replace what is being lost now. And why now, when so much military sucess is being achieved. It is very odd. I go with crazy or a weird gambit, although I do not see how that would payoff.
Let me get this straight now... all the "hip-hip hurray Ukraine is winning" zipper heads are cheering this alleged (or actual coup) as a major victory for Ukraine... when it is actually a death sentence for Ukraine if this is true--as this head of Wagner is not against Putin and the military for waging war against Ukraine--the head of Wagner is against the Russian MOD generals for not going "full Ghengis Khan mode" against Ukraine and for not impaling all Uke prisoners like Vlad Tepish and for not employing tactical nuclear weapons against NATO? --am I right?
I just have to say I love the way you write that! :'D
No its good for Russia and time is on Russian side.
If Russia goes to western Ukraine Russia will have to fight with polish army there. Be real man. War is not against ukies, war is NATO-Russia. proxy one. from very beginning.
War is againt US hegemony or US totalitarism over the planet. To be specific western transnational oligarchy vs national governments.
Ukies are just proxy army for NATO just like taliban mujahedeens back in days or Isis atm.
"Be real, man."
The nuclear power plant will be next. The Russians have allowed the Ukuleles to remain too physically close to it for too long. They should've pushed the Ukulele army further west, away from the plant, sooner
Time is not "on Russia's side" and Russia has wasted plenty of it.
Exactly.more time Russia wastes, more time parasite English have to plot so many scenarios they have already bombed gas pipe line, new bridge, another bridge connecting Ukraine to mainland etc
War is and should be against the main plotter of wars -england. .failubg to understand that will bring disaster to all the victims of Anglo pirates
Acting or not, he is one strange cat.
He is a mental case. Dangerous though.
Putin asked prigozhin to do that video. be real, man
Disagree completely.
This is a billionaire man-child throwing a tantrum because his toy is being taken away from him.
Despite popular belief, Putin is not into killing people...
Neither the Russia of today nor Putin work this way.
Then they deserve whatever chaos ensues. Nothing like snatching defeat from the jaws of victory... And an easy victory, at that.
Russia is expert in turning almost won wars into quagmire and frozen conflict .look at syria.look at Donbass from 2015. Putin is not fit to be president sergie Ivanov or demetri rigozhin should have been President
Where can we figure out what the situation is on the ground right now? Telegram?
i unsubbed, unfollowed? wagners telegram today, too crazy
Methinks the lady doth protest too much. Mr. Putin wants to be remembered with Princess Olga and her sparrows.
I have seen nothing that would prove that Prigozhin actually runs Wagner.
He is only a figurehead
I would like to think an option you missed, which is. This is all an act to get the ukies excited and rush in somewhere, probably bahkmut and get wiped out, as not too too much has been going on recently.
However, i think hes just broke his brain and needs locking in a nut house. I'd say war breaks some people, but hes just a pr guy that doesnt do any fighting so i doubt thats it.
Also, i thought letting wagner get this big was a bad idea 9 months ago.
The thing that kind of makes me think it is a psyops is that he wasn't dealt with expeditiously when he first started acting out. He was/is allowed to continue ranting and raving and now this alleged coup attempt --- just doesn't pass the sniff test...
In hindsight, in the Era of Global Internet Trolling, has POTUS Trump or Biden been the "most effective" communicator of American desires and intentions?
The Russian folk see Prig as a kind of Trump, I believe. They are not as easily lead as Western fools with Trump-Derangement-Syndrome.
As for benefits.... Prig is currently the No.1 shared topic among Ukie soldiers and pro-Ukie propaganda networks. He also happens to be the Russian commander who took Bakhmut.
Nice PR use, TBH. ;) (Y)
The thing that makes me think it wasn’t a psyop is that the net effect of all this leads much of the emerging pro-Russia world to question the stability of Russia and whether it is prudent to continue along the course of western non-alignment. The Russian government has had substantial success in the diplomatic sphere and would not jeopardize this over some short-term goal of military reorganization through a psyop. Also, Putin doesn’t appear to play those games. His love for his country precludes such nonsense.
So if Ukraine becomes un-demoralised, they are going to charge forward and die again!
Yes but this time they’re going to find a confused force, that’ll bd wondering what’s going on in the rear.
I don't think so - Putin should have this fiasco squashed (hopefully) within a week, hopefully by the end of the week-end. Then, shore up the troops, the Russian people and crush the Ukraine and any others that strike at the motherland.
Fully agree - Prigozhin will lose money/financing if he refuses MOD contract -- his personal ambition makes him a traitor to be executed
Agree with your missed option. I was beginning to think along that line myself.
He's acting like a Patton
This stunt is going to get a lot more Russians killed.
It has given "substance" to Western fantasies about regime change in Russia, meaning more aid and more weapons.
This isn't about Wagner - this is about Prigozhin's role in it. I'm sure a few of the Wagner people are with him, but I am equally sure most are not.
I hope you are right. It is impossible to know if he has the support of the PMCs. Only time will tell. But there’s no other word for Prigozhin than TRAITOR.
HOLY FOOK
There is a more sinister probability. That CIA/Ukraine intelligence services have literally fooled Prigozhin into believing that MOD is out to get him. This would require a very sophisticated network of handsomely-rewarded traitors feeding Prigozhin false narratives and sophisticated communications to appear legitimate when they're actually not. How many of Prigozhin's inner circle would betray him for payoff of $50 million each from CIA? Spending $200 MM to cause a major "internal" problem/distraction for MOD is a cheap bargain for NATO compared to the +$100 billion spent so far.
Do you really need a CIA op to convince Prigozhin the MOD was out to get him? From his very first videos it was clear that this had to be stopped.
Prigozhin clearly lost his shit. Nobody needs to get to someone who has lost his shit.
Russia absorbing Wagner into the Russian military - because Russian law does not permit PMCs to fight in Russia - is perfectly legit but is clearly what tipped Prigozhin over the edge.
MOD should get him -- for a treason